Sorry to report, but it is still happening - 3 cars lost :-(

[PSk]

Handmade Alloy 250 GTO

I'm a New Zealander so I'll appologise on behalf of the car enthusiasts in that country. NZ'ers can just about make anything ... this time unfortunately.
Pete

[tyang]

No apology for such nice craftsmanship, but I really don't understand the owner's thinking. I've heard of someone owning a real one, and building a fake to race, but seems like the concept of vinyl slip covers: when do you actually use the real thing? If you took a 20 million dollar race car and stuffed it into a ball at the track, how much could it cost to rebuild it? $250K? $500K? If you own a GTO, you can afford to race it. Ask Jim And Sandy McNeil.

For someone who doesn't own one, and makes a recreation, he'll never be accepted by real GTO owners, and his car will always be seen as a fake. At least with plastic Cobras, they're not chopping up real cars to make the thousand fakes ones on the road!

Tom

[PSk]

Yep totally agree Tom.

I'd rather race prepare the 250GT 2+2, even if it meant comprehensive modification than create a replica. He has lost Ferrari ownership and created a car that has a few Ferrari parts ... it is not a GTO and never will be.

I wish I would win Lotto ten times so I could become one of those eccentric collectors and buy all these underpriced cars and store them in a clean, dry shed ...

I'd also like to race a 250GT 2+2 and pass a real GTO ... LOL
Pete

[tyang]

Peter Kalikow has a GTO replica he made from a Series I 330 GT 2+2. The car was salvaged by a Ferrari dealership in Spring Valley, NY after an accident.

The story I heard was the first time he had the car done, he parked it next to Ralph Lauren's GTO and found the shape all wrong. A second time around he got the shape closer, but the car doesn't see much public action considering Mr. Kalikow has many other legitimate cars. With a car like that, where would Kalikow show it and not get grief for it?

Tom

[330GT]

Peter Kalikow has a GTO replica he made from a Series I 330 GT 2+2. The car was salvaged by a Ferrari dealership in Spring Valley, NY after an accident.
...Tom

Actually it was made from 9325, a series II 330 GT.

[kare]

The story I heard was the first time he had the car done, he parked it next to Ralph Lauren's GTO and found the shape all wrong.

Most people don't ever realize this. These days GTOs come in all shapes and sizes!

[PSk]

I'm further sorry to report that it seems so many still do not care and simply consider any "ugly" old Ferrari to be perfect replica material. Referring back to the thread I posted above.

I give up. I guess they all lust after the same woman (poor girl), and if they are not so lucky force their unlucky partner into plastic surgery ...

I think I'll start a car club where the only criteria to join is that the car is what it originally was, and any replication specifically excluded.
Pete

[Michael Bayer]

Forgive the repost, there is a thread extollong the "craftmenship" of a GTO recreation on F Chat, it drove me to the following rant:

"Oh great, soon we will have a threads discussing the accuracy of fakedo restorations??? With every word we make these more legitimate. Please, here at least, draw a bright line, always call what ever they are by the decades old judging standards: they are not GTO, SWB or any other thing, they are bastardized GTEs and they are not eligible for judging OR worthy of discussion.

I can buy a "genuine reproduction bronze" from the Franklin Mint, would you imagine any legitimate arts gathering engaging in hours of discussions as to whether its proportions were correct? Do you suppose it would matter to said group if some lesser artist's bronze was destroyed to create that fake? Believe me, I know cars are not art, but a fake is a fake, and in my mind unlike these we are discussing, the Fiero Daytona at least leaves the surviving few donor cars alone.

As to the argument that the "donor" is destroyed beyond rebuilding, where in the future will the surviving GTE guys get those same unobtanium parts? A 250 engine hulk is already damn near a king's ransom, and brakes, springs, frame sections and suspension parts all are crucial to maintain those cars. News flash: they don't come from your local Ferrari parts dealer, they come from the breakers or not at all. Without Tom Shaughnessy some huge portion of the pre Fiat era Ferraris would not be on the road today.

Who are the numbers? There are about 1/2 of the 474 series II 330s left, barely 40 years since production stopped, the one headlight version there are even less. There are three GTEs models, not just one, even less of each surviving, all of which need a base of drive train spares to continue to survive.

And now, after dozens and dozens of destroyed (not rebodied, destroyed) donor cars, we are now beginning to see some we like?? Please... realize to varied bad consequences these "things" are multiplying, and we are legitimizing it. I plead for full stop. "

Gentlemen please pile on at F Chat.

[tyang]

Gentlemen please pile on at F Chat.

Hi Michael,

I go to f-chat about once a week to get my fill of entertainment, but changing people's opinion over there is near impossible. Anyone who agrees with you is already here on this site, and those that argue your point don't care what we think! If you want to make a difference, invite those with similar views here, and we can leave the arguments over there!

The more enthusiasm we generate for the old original cars, perhaps more can be saved. If we have to spell it out, those people just don't get it.

Tom

[Michael Bayer]

Tom You are so right, after my post the thread became a swap meet for GTE hulks, oh well, it made ME feel better, (violating my first rule of inter net communication: what ever makes you feel good at the moment is likely not the right thing to do), M

[tyang]

Tom You are so right, after my post the thread became a swap meet for GTE hulks, oh well, it made ME feel better, (violating my first rule of inter net communication: what ever makes you feel good at the moment is likely not the right thing to do), M

Hi Michael,

I'm guilty as well by doing a fly-by on F-chat to see what you were talking about. I got sucked into responding on the GTE price check thread. I couldn't help it! They were talking about us! It was cathartic and I'm feeling much better now.

Tom

[kare]

Tom You are so right, after my post the thread became a swap meet for GTE hulks, oh well, it made ME feel better, (violating my first rule of inter net communication: what ever makes you feel good at the moment is likely not the right thing to do), M

They are just trying to make a flame baits. 12-year-old kids can do it better these days...

[Bryan P]

God help me, I contributed to that debate again, breaking Bayer's adage about feeling good . . . . .

[tyang]

Tom You are so right, after my post the thread became a swap meet for GTE hulks, oh well, it made ME feel better, (violating my first rule of inter net communication: what ever makes you feel good at the moment is likely not the right thing to do), M

They are just trying to make a flame baits. 12-year-old kids can do it better these days...

I've been lurking on this thread for a couple days and refuse to participate. It seems to be a conversation between two camps with very different opinions. You know what they say about opinions...I've got one too! From the e-mails I get on this topic, I have proof there is a lot of support against cutting up cars to make replicas, fakes, or tribute cars, despite what these guys think or say. Just because this support is not responding to this thread does not mean there is less support. Remember, the loudest guy might not necessarily be the guy who's right or popular. It only proves he's louder. We're NEVER going to change their point of view. Our actions will speak far louder by not engaging in this silly argument. Most of us ARE doing something about it by keeping, maintaining, and restoring a 2+2s in our garages.

Tom

[Bryan P]

off topic - but I just noticed that I joined tomyang.net before Tom Yang did!


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