Is it time to Sell?

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tyang
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Is it time to Sell?

Post by tyang » Mon Nov 05, 2007 11:29 pm

Hi All,

Two things came to mind when I found out the auction price of the 330 America at RM: Crap, I have to raise my insurance coverage again, and Should I sell the 330 America now?

Some friends of mine say, "SELL! Take the money, and put it in a mutal fund," but they are not Ferrari owners. I feel that if I sell my 330 America now and take the money, it will be very hard to get back in the game. Just like people watching their house values increase, what would they buy in their neighborhood if they sold? I may not be rich, but my life is richer from having this Ferrari.

The only way I would sell my 330 America would be if I could find a Project Lusso. Although I don't think a Lusso with needs would equal the value of my 330, I can dream, can't I? (If anyone has any leads, let me know!)

The other thought is as I spend more time with my 330 America, I begin to realize what some people have been telling me all along. The America is a better car. The Lusso may be sexier in shape, but the 330 America is more pragmatic with lots of room for my family, and an overdrive transmission for easy long distance travel. I guess I love my America, but I still lust for a Lusso!

Tom
'63 330 America #5053

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Art S.
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Post by Art S. » Mon Nov 05, 2007 11:51 pm

Tom,

Sell the America and buy two projects :)

Regards,

Art S.
1965 330 2+2 series 2 7919

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Art S.
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Post by Art S. » Tue Nov 06, 2007 12:01 am

Tom,

Let me clarify, get two 2+2 projects ;)

Actually, to adress your question seriously: you are just finishing the sorting of your car, do you own it for the joy of the restoration or the fun of continued ownership? If it's for the restoration then, now is a great time to move on. On the othe hand, you have a really great car, why not enjoy it!

On another note, there is no question that your car is a much better driving car than a Lusso!

Regards,

Art S.
1965 330 2+2 series 2 7919

Rudy van Daalen Wetters
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Post by Rudy van Daalen Wetters » Tue Nov 06, 2007 2:03 am

Tom,

Looks can be deceiving. The America is the better car and besides you know what you have now. Reality check becomes more difficult in a virtual world.

Rudy van Daalen Wetters
1963 GTE s/n 4001
1966 330 GT s/n 8705

abrent
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Post by abrent » Tue Nov 06, 2007 7:43 am

I'd like to hear David Booth's opinion on this. Simply because he is one person I know who owned a GTE through the nutty 88-91 period where cars went up and then down again in value. While I agree that fear is making me hold my car, like Tom, (fear of getting back in the game - that is), I dunno if perhaps it would be better to send our cars on down the road only to invite a similar one back in a couple years.

Thoughts anyone?

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tyang
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Post by tyang » Tue Nov 06, 2007 8:10 am

Actually, to adress your question seriously: you are just finishing the sorting of your car, do you own it for the joy of the restoration or the fun of continued ownership? If it's for the restoration then, now is a great time to move on. On the othe hand, you have a really great car, why not enjoy it!
It's a question that has been posed before. As much as there was the goal of finishing the car, I realized through the years how much I actually enjoyed working on the car. Although I get my fill working on all sorts of Ferraris these days, there isn't the same satisfaction I get from doing the work on my own car.

I love my 330 America, and probably have too much blood, sweat, tears, and history with her to let her go that easily. Besides, we've just begun the next chapter in our history!

If I had the funds, I would just buy another project and restore it, amassing a collection of old Ferraris that I've ressurected through the years. That would be fun. Now to figure out a way to do it!

Tom
'63 330 America #5053

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tyang
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Post by tyang » Tue Nov 06, 2007 8:26 am

I'd like to hear David Booth's opinion on this. Simply because he is one person I know who owned a GTE through the nutty 88-91 period where cars went up and then down again in value. While I agree that fear is making me hold my car, like Tom, (fear of getting back in the game - that is), I dunno if perhaps it would be better to send our cars on down the road only to invite a similar one back in a couple years.

Thoughts anyone?
Hi Andrew,

The thought had occured to me, but how long would I have to go "Ferrariless" waiting for the market to turn? When my wife and I sold our apartment in NYC, the market was pretty high, and we managed to use the profit to settle our debts, take a trip to Australia, and reinvent oursleves outside of Manhattan. When we sold, we knew we were leaving the NYC Real Estate Market for good. I believe even with a drop in the Market, it would probably never return to the price I originally paid for my apt. I feel this could be the same for Vintage Ferraris. If I needed the cash for my car to do something else, I would be selling it today, but selling it to buy something in the future could have you waiting for a while, maybe forever.

Another thing I'm realizing is most people who want to buy a Ferrari are always 10% or more short of what it costs to buy a Ferrari. The difference between Ferrari owners and Ferrari dreamers is owners find a way to come up with that extra 10% to buy a car. The rest just continue to dream. This has no bearing on the condition of the market. When I bought my car in 1999, it was still a lot of money for a car in parts in pieces, but I borrowed the extra I needed to get it. The genius in all this was not my doing. I was driven purely by desire. Most guys who I talk to who own Ferraris, at least us commoners, stretched to buy the car we now own. I feel the same thing will happen if you sell high today, and try to buy when the market comes back down. Will you have the extra 10% in your life when it comes time to buy again?

Just my opinion.

Tom
'63 330 America #5053

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tyang
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Post by tyang » Tue Nov 06, 2007 8:31 am

Looks can be deceiving. The America is the better car and besides you know what you have now. Reality check becomes more difficult in a virtual world.
Hi Rudy,

Just like every red-blooded male, we lust for the super model, but the 330 America is great car. I realize this more and more every day.

Tom
'63 330 America #5053

Jimmyr
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Post by Jimmyr » Tue Nov 06, 2007 9:00 am

I agree with Tom, the pride and interest in doing it yourself is much more rewarding than going to a dealer and shelling out a ton of cash for a new V8!

My cars will be my legacy for my children! Jim

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sam231
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Post by sam231 » Tue Nov 06, 2007 9:30 am

Keep it Tom so I can drive it again at the next Party! :wink:

Seriuosly, with the way prices are going and the noteriety your restoration of the America has you would probably get an obscene amount of $$ if you sold......but the driving fun would be gone. Are you in it for the restoration or the fun of owning and driving a great car you can say you rebuilt yourself. If you are really in the restoration business, try contacting a few friends to see if they will back you. You might be suprised.

Owning a Ferrari is certainly much more entertaining than clipping coupons or watching stock prices every day, take it from one who does that for a living.
'72 365 GTC/4 # 14953; ex-owner 330 GT 2+2 # 8025 :>(

Rangeley
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Post by Rangeley » Tue Nov 06, 2007 9:32 am

Dear T, How many times have I figuratively kicked my butt for selling: 1964 Alfa Julia Veloce Sprint, the best driving car I ever owned; my three MGTC's, always fun, the three XK-E's, trouble every day but sexy as heck; and finally, my first 330 which my girlfriend said spent too much time in my garage. I now consider myself a lucky guy because I bought my second 330 in early 2000's for what is now a pittance. My point, every time I even think about selling for a profit I have only to remind myself of how much I missed the exotic after I sold it. This one will be inherited. John

Rudy van Daalen Wetters
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Post by Rudy van Daalen Wetters » Tue Nov 06, 2007 12:12 pm

Imagine your father owning 0650 MDTR and after 30 years of ownership, letting it go and then seeing the same car sell for double a few years later.
The money is meaningless, I will forever regret seeing the car go.

Rudy van Daalen Wetters
1963 GTE s/n 4001
1966 330 GT s/n 8705

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John Vardanian
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Post by John Vardanian » Tue Nov 06, 2007 12:29 pm

Hi Tom,

Leave the sentiments to the sentimentals and reach for the redder apple! This is the better thing for the longer term. It's all about the 10 percent rule.

john
PF Coupe

jsa330
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Post by jsa330 » Tue Nov 06, 2007 12:45 pm

Tom:

You're getting there with the 10%...but add another 15 to it.

My own thoughts on your situation, assuming you could net $250K from selling the America:

-Just selling and banking the money isn't going to work for you...forget that.

-The obvious path is to stay right where you are...keep the America. Only additional expense is more insurance.

-Or, sell and find a really needy Lusso for $250K, which will then set you back another $100K in resto costs over the next few years.

Alternately:

-IMO, vintage 12 2+2 prices have spiked and may drop 10%, but have reached a permanent plateau. If you do want max financial return, sell now, and pay the cap gains.

-For a family man, there is wisdom in the counsel coming from your Ferrariless friends/relatives. $150K in a conservative growth and income fund is a nice chunk to have; the other $100K goes to another car.

-The tendency is always to step up to a more-desirable car, but if you were willing to step down to a 330 2+2, GTE, or 365 2+2, you could have your cake and eat it--daughter's education paid for and have a Ferrari. You might even be able to scrounge up a needy 330GTC for $150K, and still bank $100K.

-Tom Yang is an established name the Ferrari world. Your stature will not be diminished by going to a lesser car. Another online resto would be a continuation of your tradition of inspiration to fellow owners and aspiring owners.

Bottom line conclusion: Whatever you do, you're going to have to have a Ferrari with 12 cylinders in front.

Rudy van Daalen Wetters
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Post by Rudy van Daalen Wetters » Tue Nov 06, 2007 12:56 pm

Even the redder apples may be full of worms....

Rudy van Daalen Wetters
1963 GTE s/n 4001
1966 330 GT s/n 8705

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