New buyer, Islero vs. 250 GTE

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oschulze
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New buyer, Islero vs. 250 GTE

Post by oschulze » Tue Mar 11, 2008 7:23 pm

Hello all,

I am a new buyer interested initially in an Islero, but then realized for a similar price I could move into Ferrari territory and get what I view as being a much more attractive car in the 250 GTE.

That said, given that I can spend about ~$90k in initial acquisition, which vehicle will give me less hassle and cost less over its life?

I will be able to do very good diligence on whatever actual vehicle I purchase, so hope that surprises will be kept to a minimum. (friend has an Islero, father has and personally maintains a 1936 4 1/4 Bentley and my brother races modified 944s)

I know this is apples and oranges, but if you were in the territory where you can't afford a pristine 250 GTE what would you do?

Thanks so much and am excited that I found this forum, Tom's 250 GTE buying guide has already been a big help.

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tyang
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Post by tyang » Tue Mar 11, 2008 8:22 pm

Hi oschulze,

Welcome to my forum. I hope we can guide you in the right direction.

First off, if you can find a GTE in pristine condition for $95K, BUY IT! I have not seen any trading for that kind of money in three years. It's unfortunate that the prices for these cars have gone up so much for people who want to get them, but perhaps the change in the economy may change things around. I don't even think Series II 330s are selling below $100K these days. The trick is to poised and ready to buy if the market shows any sign of falling!

Tom
'63 330 America #5053

Rudy van Daalen Wetters
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Post by Rudy van Daalen Wetters » Tue Mar 11, 2008 8:35 pm

I would think that with only about 100 or less Isleros around, you would get more bang for your buck with the GTE. Drive the GTE and see if that is what appeals to you. The Islero is more modern and refined. I prefer the 'motoring' sense that is inherent with the GTE. As far as less hassle and less cost over the life that can only be determined on a car by car basis when it comes to this vintage machinery. If you are easily frustrated, neither car is for you.

Rudy van Daalen Wetters
1963 GTE s/n 4001
1866 330 GT s/n 8705

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tyang
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Post by tyang » Tue Mar 11, 2008 8:53 pm

Another thought is to check yourself for fit! GTEs are very quirky fitting cars. Besides the usual Ferrari driving position that we all conform our bodies to, the GTE's windshield is very close to the top of the steering wheel. Visibility is also hard for shorter drivers but that can be solved with seat spacers. Tall drivers have extended the seat rails for more leg room. Find a GTE and sit in it before committing more time in your search!

Tom
'63 330 America #5053

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Yale
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Post by Yale » Tue Mar 11, 2008 9:16 pm

I've always wanted an Islero. However at the last Concorso Italiano I saw a guy with a 400GT, (the predecessor to the Islero), in amongst the other Lambo guys (an girls!) with the huge Lambo graphics on their cars or jackets looking sort of out of place. Now this guy had owned that 400GT for some 30 years and had put tons of miles on it and he probably didn't feel out of place at all. However, it was apparent to me that the history of Ferrari is so interesting, the owners of the older Ferraris are interesting, the search for parts is difficult but there is more then one or two avenues to go down, and that all adds up to the overall ownership experience with Ferrari is more fun.

If you get a chance to drive a GTE you should, it is sort of like a very good 50's car. The Islero is faster, handles better, is overall a better car but then so is any Honda. I own a 330GT, the orginal, anomalous, and I feel inimitable, four headlight version, and that car is closer to an Islero but with better parentage.

Maybe I should get this instead:

Image

Yale
Ex - 1964 330GT #6097
1963 Abarth Monomille
1970 Porsche 911S
1974 BMW 2002turbo

Rudy van Daalen Wetters
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Post by Rudy van Daalen Wetters » Tue Mar 11, 2008 9:37 pm

Um, maybe not. Might work for daughter, though.

Rudy van Daalen Wetters
1963 GTE s/n 4001
1966 330 GT s/n 8705

oschulze
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Post by oschulze » Wed Mar 12, 2008 10:21 am

great advice, thanks guys.

It's good to hear that there are no hard line opinions on this one, that my apples to oranges assumption is more less accurate.

I have found a very nice 250 for sale in my area and am going to try to get out to see it sometime this week as it may fit my criteria.

One other question would be what series is best to try to buy for overall reliability (I, II, III etc) although as always, I know that each car's quality varies from car to car after 40+ years.

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tyang
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Post by tyang » Wed Mar 12, 2008 10:33 am

There are only subtle differences between cars. I outlined them in the buyer's guide which you've seen. Mechanically, the later cars are supposed to be more powerful, but I believe the increase is negligible in real world driving.

If you're going to take it for a test drive, make sure the overdrive works and there are no drive line vibrations at speed. Some of these issues can be an easy fix, or very expensive, so be aware!

If you're thinking about buying the car, I can't emphasize enough have a THIRD PARTY PRE PURCHASE INSPECTION done on the car!

Good luck.

Tom
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jsa330
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Post by jsa330 » Thu Mar 13, 2008 12:10 pm

There's an Islero that they're reconditioning for a customer at the Ferrari shop in Dallas that I use; not for sale.

It's a great looking car, and a reminder of the days when Lambos were sensibly-designed (the last good one was the Miura).
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400iman
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Post by 400iman » Thu Mar 13, 2008 3:32 pm

[quote="Yale"]I've always wanted an Islero. However at the last Concorso Italiano I saw a guy with a 400GT, (the predecessor to the Islero), in amongst the other Lambo guys (an girls!) with the huge Lambo graphics on their cars or jackets looking sort of out of place. Now this guy had owned that 400GT for some 30 years and had put tons of miles on it and he probably didn't feel out of place at all. However, it was apparent to me that the history of Ferrari is so interesting, the owners of the older Ferraris are interesting, the search for parts is difficult but there is more then one or two avenues to go down, and that all adds up to the overall ownership experience with Ferrari is more fun.

If you get a chance to drive a GTE you should, it is sort of like a very good 50's car. The Islero is faster, handles better, is overall a better car but then so is any Honda. I own a 330GT, the orginal, anomalous, and I feel inimitable, four headlight version, and that car is closer to an Islero but with better parentage.

Maybe I should get this instead:

Yale[/quote]

OSchulze, I haven't owned a GTE (would love to), but I have owned 3 Isleros. Mechanically they are far advanced, but build quality is questionable, and they do take a bit more work to get them running right (twice as many carbs and cams). If you can get a clean GTE for under $100k, jump on it, but I haven't seen one that cheap in over a year.

Yale, I do take exception to your "better parentage" comment. Let's be honest, Enzo was a luddite, sticking with drum brakes when others went disk, 2 cams when others went for 4, and front engined when the competition went mid-engined. If it weren't for Lamborghini overcompensating for lack of history with advanced mechanicals and design, I don't believe the current Ferraris would be as advanced as they are.

As for the loud jackets and wild graphics, there are definitely two camps in the Lambo fold. The vintage Lambo owners, the numbers of which are dwindling much as are the vintage Ferrari owners, are generally older and much more reserved than the post Countach crowd. We tend to work on our own cars and certainly don't try to impress with fancy wheels, wings, and graphics. I wouldn't mind a few more young women hanging around us though. :)

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tyang
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Post by tyang » Thu Mar 13, 2008 5:46 pm

As for the loud jackets and wild graphics, there are definitely two camps in the Lambo fold. The vintage Lambo owners, the numbers of which are dwindling much as are the vintage Ferrari owners, are generally older and much more reserved than the post Countach crowd. We tend to work on our own cars and certainly don't try to impress with fancy wheels, wings, and graphics. I wouldn't mind a few more young women hanging around us though. :)
Has anyone seen at the crowds hanging around the new Ferraris? The Ferrari Regalia is just as prevalent as the Lambo Bull!

Tom
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Rudy van Daalen Wetters
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Post by Rudy van Daalen Wetters » Thu Mar 13, 2008 5:52 pm

If I wear a dining room lamp chain from the 70's around my neck, I could easily pass as a new owner.

Rudy van Daalen Wetters
1963 GTE s/n 4001
1966 330 GT s/n 8705

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Yale
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Post by Yale » Thu Mar 13, 2008 7:45 pm

Yale, I do take exception to your "better parentage" comment. Let's be honest, Enzo was a luddite, sticking with drum brakes when others went disk, 2 cams when others went for 4, and front engined when the competition went mid-engined. If it weren't for Lamborghini overcompensating for lack of history with advanced mechanicals and design, I don't believe the current Ferraris would be as advanced as they are.


That is why I said the Islero was a better car. But then I went further to say that the fact that one car is "better" then the other is not why we are in this hobby. There are a myriad reasons and how well the car does what it is supposed to be is not really the deciding factor or we would all be driving Toyatas....like Tom Y. ( And remember I really like Isleros).

And Rudy, I am going to get some big gold chains and stand near you at Quail, hah!
Ex - 1964 330GT #6097
1963 Abarth Monomille
1970 Porsche 911S
1974 BMW 2002turbo

Rudy van Daalen Wetters
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Post by Rudy van Daalen Wetters » Thu Mar 13, 2008 9:35 pm

Yale,

Ok, and bring the Polaroid sunglasses to cut down on the glare. Now, just where did I put those Cohiba cigars? ...

Rudy van Daalen Wetters
1963 GTE s/n 4001
1966 330 GT s/n 8705

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Art S.
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Post by Art S. » Thu Mar 13, 2008 10:55 pm

Rudy,

I have the Cubans.

Regards,

Art S.

PS. If you are debating whether to get marque value of the 250 GTE or the advanced characteristics of the Islero, get a 330GT and have the best of both...
1965 330 2+2 series 2 7919

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