New buyer, Islero vs. 250 GTE

[Michael Bayer]

This is trending very FCattish.........

[xs10shl]

Keeping my own opinions to myself as to how I feel about Ferrari vs. Lamborghini owners, I do have this tidbit of advice to add:

If this is your first Italian car, buy the best example you can afford of either. A great Islero will be far more satisfying than a neglected 250, and vice-versa.

Then, when you've realized you've made a mistake, sell whatever you've bought and buy a Lancia, and be happy again! ;^)

[Rudy van Daalen Wetters]

Hey, good point on the Lancia theory. I have a 1960 Lancia Flaminia Touring and am duly impressed by the quality and engineering of the car.
A real delight. Viva Lancia!

Rudy van Daalen Wetters
1963 GTE s/n 4001
1966 330 GT s/n 8705

[330 America]

Thanks for the tip on the Islero at Boardwalk Ferrari as I might just call them and see what kind of $$$ it would take to buy the car (every owner has a selling price).

I think this is a great discussion because any astute car collector (particularly those with interest in Italian cars) should be trying to figure out the next up and comer and make the purchase investments (assuming they have the cash). Point in case is the recent run up in the early 1980's 512BB from a $90K car to $140K+ in a short timeframe.

Personally, I LOVE the Islero -- despite its documented poor panel fitment (nice history about the Islero coachbuilding snafu's at the Lamborghini Registry site). Of course, like the Ghibli -- the "S" version (Ghibli had a SS version) is desirable due to more power and minor improvements at the end of the model production run.

Most of you know that the two biggest gaff's I've made is "passing" on a Lusso about two years ago in the $300K range and a nice Lambo 400GT for $125K also back in 2006. I should have borrowed money (if that's what it took) to buy both -- but I didn't. Now that a good 400GT is bringing $200,000 its the Islero's turn to run up in value. At the 2007 Russo & Steel Auction a nice Islero (#2- condition) brought only $65K and I've found another #2- Islero last month for $100K (its had a color change, which I hate). These cars will definitely run "up" as the 400GT is pulling it along in much the same way we've seen 246 Dino's (previously a car you couldn't give away) and even the early '70's 365GTC's going up due to the pull of the Daytona (when you can't afford $300K, cars at $125K start looking real good).

I agree with Tom -- drive both and see what feels best (seating position, visibility, "gut" instinct). I also agree that you should buy the best car -- Ferrari or Lambo, because restoration costs will kill you (need I write a book?) I definitely side with the few Lambo supporters on this post that the Lambo (in many cases) is a better built car than a Ferrari during the same period in automotive history. As beautiful as a Lusso is -- I have to admit I'm a sucker for a Miura. There are as many "Tony Montana" Ferrari guys as Lambo guys at the shows -- as just as many gentlemen.

If anyone finds a nice Islero -- send her my way!!!

[oschulze]

thanks again. I saw the 250GTE I mentioned (see online at www.copleymotorcars.com) but unfortunatly someone had broken the key upon delivery and they were awaiting a new one...I could not take it for a drive.

That said, the second I sat in the car it felt perfect. I am very tall (6'7) and had enough space both for head, hands and legs. The car is simply fantastic. They had a Dino next to it and I could have cared less.

However, the market for these cars is very difficult (at least online) do you guys have good suggestions for finding 250GTE's for sale in New England or the East Coast? Also, what have the price progressions been over the past two years?

[oschulze]

also may I add that I was a little sketched out by the car. The odometer was clearly rewound (however the seller fully acknowledged this and was in the process of putting together a seemingly very honest history of the car.) but there were other things like badly patched paint, knock off replacement parts on the borannis, and other "off" aspects of the car that made the $168K asking outrageous.

However, the same place, copley motorcars, had just sold a plain jane white 300SL cabriolet for $495,000

The current car market is outrageous, can't wait for it to come down.

[330 America]

Mr Schultz - I cannot speak for the integrity of Copley Motorcars although I approached them in 2005 regarding a sportscar purchase I wanted to make and they seemed marginally willing to obtain the information I wanted on the car -- so I decided to pass on it.

With regards to your thinking that you can limit your geographic search for a good GTE to New England may be somewhat wishful thinking. You're going to have go to where the good car is located to decide if its for you and then be prepared to pay to ship the car back to your location. I have purchased a lot of interesting sports cars in the past 10 years and none of them were local in Texas (where I live). Thus, I had to have PPI's conducted on the car and then fly out and drive them home (or ship them in the case of old classics). This can be an expensive, time-consuming endeavor but we live in an international car collecting world so you go to the car.

If you like the 250GTE, then the hard part is over (picking the right chassis/vintage/marque). Now you need exercise patience in finding the right car so can avoide the unfortunate scenario I've been in to have to restore your Ferrari from scratch. I think you're doing the right thing by being both quantitative (owner records, prepurchase inspection, etc.) and qualitative (your gut feel about the car's condition and driveability) in your assessment.

The guys on this thread will have varying opinions, but my read of the 250GTE market for 2008 is as follows for US cars sold to US buyers:

#5 car - $75,000
#4 car - $110,000
#3 car - $140,000
#2 car - $165,000
#1 car - $185,000

What can skew this is the Euro situation as #3 cars in Europe are fetching 75,000-100,000 Euro's which can bump up the USD equivalent a bit. However, I am always suspicious of so-called "restored" European cars because their restoration standards are seldom is good as the US and their weather is not conducive to keeping the cars in rust-free condition.

[400iman]

thanks again. I saw the 250GTE I mentioned (see That said, the second I sat in the car it felt perfect. I am very tall (6'7) and had enough space both for head, hands and legs. The car is simply fantastic. They had a Dino next to it and I could have cared less.

At 6'7", the Islero is definitely too small for you. I am 6'2", and I have to lean the seat back a bit and still my head rubs the headliner. With the seats in the stock location there will also be insufficient leg room. You could possible modify the mounting location, but you'll only get a couple inches before the seat hits the back seat. My friend had a 330 2+2 that is similar in size to the GTE and it had a lot more room. As for the Dino, I agree with you there. How they can be over $100k, let alone $200k, is beyond me.

Good luck with your search.