barn-find 330

Moderators: 330GT, abrent

Ruedi
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Post by Ruedi » Tue Jul 29, 2003 6:04 pm

Yes, Tom. Inflation will take care of that.

The right buyer for this car, whatever the price may be, is a person who sees him/herself as a guardian who gives it whatever it needs.

I didn't buy my cars as "investments". I bought them because I their form and character spoke to me. To this day, I feel that my cars selected me more than I selected them. But I knew that -- should I ever sell them -- I can get back whatever cash I put into them.

And yes, I too do a lot of work myself. I too scraped off the undercoating by hand. Those who did it know what kind of mess this is -- and how sore some muscles are the next day. But, in perverse kind of way, I enjoyed every minute of it. I learned a lot about the car and gained much confidence that the cars are very solid.

Same as the car for sale here, one of my other cars will require about 300 hours of block sanding. There's no way I could justify paying someone for it. So, I'll learn what I need to do a nice job. The reward is far more than a great looking paint job. It is familiarity with every curve that defines the shape of the car.

I'll never put a price tag on my time. Fixing my cars is like an adventure that allows me to get insight into a different world of skill and experience. This gives me more thrill than any game I know.

As I wrote in an earlier message, car buffs often ignore the economic concept of bounded rationality. And that's good.

Ruedi

abrent
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That 330 AM.

Post by abrent » Wed Jul 30, 2003 7:55 am

For christ's sake, will someone offer her 27K so we can all get on with our lives.

Oh, 10 times the purchase price to restore - what planet do you all think this is. Something like this, which as Dave say's seems all there, would only consume about 25K/35K if you threw in some elbow grease yourself. AND repected it for what it is, a driver - not a concorso queen.
Less if you do it in Australia....

Bye.

SLM
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Post by SLM » Wed Jul 30, 2003 10:37 am

I concur with rally GTX. Excellent point.I once bought a 356 porsche from an owner who wanted tha same thing- to see the car restored not parted. Consequently the price was cheap. I would probably not buy this car for $3500. I can see easily spending 75-100k. One could easily buy a 330 america of 250gte in excellent condition for that price and have money left over. Actually you probably buy 2 cars! Shame on the current owner for letting this car rot away. But I hope as you all do that this car stays intact!

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tyang
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Post by tyang » Wed Jul 30, 2003 11:12 am

Yale and I were talking last night, and searched for available 250GTEs, and found hardly any. I don't think it is as easy as you may think to find a perfect GTE for any kind of money. The prospect of 330 Americas needing no work is even slimmer.

Tom

Ruedi
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Post by Ruedi » Wed Jul 30, 2003 7:27 pm

Tom,

The list that follows is an excerpt from the Sports Car Market magazine auction database (see http://www.sportscarmarket.com), covering the last 18 months or so. SCM prices usually include buyer's premium for the auction house. Please note that cars #2 and #3 have not sold at these prices.

This type of information (and the specific comments about the condition and presentation of each car I omitted here) is why I suggested in a different thread that prospective buyers should subscribe to SCM, an establishment I have no affiliation with other than being a subscriber.

BTW: The auction database lists only one 330 America (#4993) in #3 condition, not sold in 1993 at a high bid of USD 40k.

Best regards,

Ruedi



Ferrari - 250 GTE - 1962 High Bid/Sold Price: $48,230
Vehicle ID #: 2921 - Condition Rating: 3-
Sale Status: Sold - SCM Number: 30810 - Sale Date: 2/7/2003


Ferrari - 250 GTE SII 2+2 - 1962 High Bid/Sold Price: $49,729
Vehicle ID #: 3071 - Condition Rating: 2+
Sale Status: Not Sold - SCM Number: 29701 - Sale Date: 12/20/2002


Ferrari - 250 GTE SIII 2+2 - 1963 High Bid/Sold Price: $55,212
Vehicle ID #: 4745 - Condition Rating: 2+
Sale Status: Not Sold - SCM Number: 29702 - Sale Date: 12/20/2002


Ferrari - 250 GTE 2+2 SI - 1962 High Bid/Sold Price: $41,975
Vehicle ID #: 2675 - Condition Rating: 1-
Sale Status: Sold - SCM Number: 29298 - Sale Date: 10/11/2002


Ferrari - 250 GTE - 1963 High Bid/Sold Price: $44,865
Vehicle ID #: 4305 - Condition Rating: 3-
Sale Status: Sold - SCM Number: 28993 - Sale Date: 8/17/2002


Ferrari - 250 GTE 2+2 - 1964 High Bid/Sold Price: $30,800
Vehicle ID #: 2795 - Condition Rating: 5
Sale Status: Sold - SCM Number: 28472 - Sale Date: 5/25/2002


Ferrari - 250 GTE - 1962 High Bid/Sold Price: $12,000
Vehicle ID #: 3637 - Condition Rating: 6
Sale Status: Sold - SCM Number: 28473 - Sale Date: 5/25/2002


Ferrari - 250 GTE 2+2 - 1962 High Bid/Sold Price: $60,801
Vehicle ID #: 3571 - Condition Rating: 1-
Sale Status: Sold - SCM Number: 24242 - Sale Date: 12/18/2001


Ferrari - 250 GTE 2+2 - 1963 High Bid/Sold Price: $53,299
Vehicle ID #: 4745 - Condition Rating: 2
Sale Status: Sold - SCM Number: 24245 - Sale Date: 12/18/2001

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tyang
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Post by tyang » Wed Jul 30, 2003 8:27 pm

Hi Ruedi,

Thanks. I still say that there are a bunch of costs involved that drive these cars higher after you buy them. Show me one Ferrari for sale that needs nothing, and I'll stop believing that all you need to spend is $40K-50K for an old Ferrari.

I am in touch with dozens of Ferrari owners that have $$$ tied up in their cars, and all of them know that they will probably never recoup their investment, even though they may tell their wives otherwise! We all want to get a good deal, and no one wants to be a fool, but my point is it's not all about re-sale!

I hope whoever buys this car restores it. I know I've made my mark on 5053, and I hope in the future, my legacy will live on in this car. 4973 deserves a second chance at life!

Now let's move on!

Tom

judge4re
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Post by judge4re » Wed Jul 30, 2003 8:38 pm

Tom,

Yeah, when gas is $4 a gallon. A rising tide (inflation) raises all boats.

I've got Sunday blocked out to go look at it. Leaving my checkbook at home (always a good thing the first time) but bringing Karen (reality check) and a screwdriver (personal reality check, rust the eater of neat cars). Besides, I'm tired of looking at Karen's Lexus in the garage next to 18759.

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tyang
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Post by tyang » Wed Jul 30, 2003 9:01 pm

Good luck Erik, and we'd love a report!

Tom

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Yale
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Post by Yale » Wed Jul 30, 2003 9:44 pm

As Tom was saying I looked in both Hemmings and Classic Driver and found only one GTE for sale, a red one in White Plains NY, no price given. Ruedi shows that Sports Car Market has listed nine for sale at auction around the world in the last three years. I am sure they missed some but this is no longer as common a car as you might expect. In Kerry's site I counted 40 known (Series 1 only) 330GT's that have been turned into GTO's and the like, this is a little less then 10% of what was made. The 1999 edition of the GTE Register shows 117 GTE's were rebodied and 5 of the America's. Again around 10%. Isn't it amazing there are that many fakes out there? Ten percent of the GTE's, America's , Series 1 and 2 330's, P.F. Coupes, adds up to a lot of cars.

Yale

andy
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Post by andy » Thu Jul 31, 2003 9:39 am

Where are the pictures and info on this barn find car?

Thanks,
Andy

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330GT
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Post by 330GT » Fri Aug 01, 2003 12:01 am

Look at Tom's 7/26 entry.

andy
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Post by andy » Fri Aug 01, 2003 10:00 am

This is Tom's 7/26 entry, but there's no link to the photos...

Andy
tyang wrote:Is the car worth $35K? Considering the the engine is worth $15K, the transmission is probably worth $5K, and the rear diff at $3-5K (easily converted to a Lusso), you can see how the car can be worth that kind of money. Ironically it's worth more split up, than in one piece, that is why Shaughnessy splits a few of these cars up every year!

I'm just trying to keep all of them from disappearing into oblivion! It might be a fruitless endeavor against the need to make profit, but there should be some respect for the preservation for history!!!

Tom

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330GT
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Post by 330GT » Fri Aug 01, 2003 11:10 am

Look at Tom's diary entry on 7/26:
http://www.tomyang.net/cars/ferrari.htm ... ari364.htm

Photos, story, etc.

rodog
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Post by rodog » Sat Aug 02, 2003 12:08 pm

FYI-

Searching through Collector Car Trader Online this Morning and saw this same (possible) car listed for $45,000. It is in Alexander, AL with 17,000 miles. The ad says:
1963 FERRARI 330 America: One of 50 built, one of 17 remaining. Has been restored for 30 years. 17, 000 original miles. All original, paint, interior, tool kit, everything you need to have a legend. Must come and inspect personally. $45, 000. Call 256-329-1517 or email:coven@webshoppe.net Serious inquiries only!!!(256) 329-1517.

The date placed was july 30, 2003.

Talk about inflation??? And a very interesting restoration? ( or storage???)
Greg

Deborah Wilson
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Post by Deborah Wilson » Sun Aug 03, 2003 5:31 pm

Greetings, I just wanted to thank Tom for all the help he has given concerning my 330 America. Erik Nielsen , his fiance' Karen and I just spent the afternoon going over the car and I am really pleased with how well the day went. Erik took bunches of photos and all the serial numbers. We discussed prices and my reasons for wanting to sell my car.
In the last two weeks I have recieved over 70 emails and phone calls. Most of the folks I spoke with were very nice and sincere. Some of you people need to get a life though. Last night I read the message that said I offered the car in an online ad for $45,000. NOt me! I have found a thread which listed the car in three different trade sights though I am really not sure how they got there. I haven't run an ad on anything in over 6 months. Anyone who wants to get the correct information can contact Erik. He is a delightful man and very knowledgeable about Ferraris. Thanks for all the interest! Deb

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