Oil Recommendations

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enio45
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Oil Recommendations

Post by enio45 » Tue Dec 29, 2009 2:29 pm

Im in the process of replacing the Trans Oil, Manual Steering Box oil and the Rear Axle Fluid.

Book calls for Shell EP 90 for the trans, EP140 for the steering box and EP250 for the rear axle.

Does anyone have a recommended type, brand, mdl for each of these that are equivalent in todays terms etc.

I was told to be careful on the trans oil as the wrong oil can messup the syncro's.

Appreciate the advise...
Ed Montini
330 GT 2+2 Series II - 8289
58 Ellena - 0855GT - orig drivetrain

Michael Bayer
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Re: Oil Recommendations

Post by Michael Bayer » Tue Dec 29, 2009 7:46 pm

Ed I put Swepco in the trans the Porsche synchros seemed to really like it, Tom has a long bit on here somewhere about diff fluid options, the 250wt seemed just too much for non competitive driving for me. All the best for the New Year! m
Michael J. Bayer
330GT s/n 9727
365GTC4 s/n 14943
Dino Spider s/n 1193

8339
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Re: Oil Recommendations

Post by 8339 » Wed Dec 30, 2009 8:59 am

Ed, just to add to Michael's suggestion, look for Penrite Steering box lube, it's a 1200w fluid that doesn't leak. Regular gear oil in a manual steering box will eventually leak out. The Penrite is obviously very thick but it's made specifically for steering gearboxes. Go to www.restorationstuff.com or call 800-306-7008, Restoration Supply Company.

Richard Garre
Radcliffe Motorcar Company

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tyang
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Re: Oil Recommendations

Post by tyang » Thu Dec 31, 2009 7:34 am

Hi Ed,

Restoration Supply also has the 250 Weight rear diff oil.

I've used Swepco for the gear box and also Redline MT 90. Ferrari synchros are notorious for being slow to warm up, but with the Redline synthetic gear oil, I noticed less resistance when the gear box was ice cold.

Tom
'63 330 America #5053

andrew
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Re: Oil Recommendations

Post by andrew » Fri Jan 01, 2010 7:31 pm

I use Castrol 20W50 for the engine; Redline 75W90ns for the differential; Redline MTL 75/90 for the transmission (5 spd). I'm considering moving to a thicker diff fluid (very slight leak, even after replacing the pinion seal) and perhaps different transmission oil, which I'm not happy with. Specific suggestions are welcome.
'64 330 America s/n 5109

Timo
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Re: Oil Recommendations

Post by Timo » Fri Jan 01, 2010 8:29 pm

Andrew,
with all due respect, but in most cases switching to different (="thicker") oil will not cure leaks. Leaks are usually occurring when something other than lubricant is amiss.
Timo

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tyang
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Re: Oil Recommendations

Post by tyang » Fri Jan 01, 2010 8:29 pm

andrew wrote:I use Castrol 20W50 for the engine; Redline 75W90ns for the differential; Redline MTL 75/90 for the transmission (5 spd). I'm considering moving to a thicker diff fluid (very slight leak, even after replacing the pinion seal) and perhaps different transmission oil, which I'm not happy with. Specific suggestions are welcome.
Hi Andrew,

The most important thing is to remember to use 30 Weight Non Detergent motor oil in the overdrive unit to your 330 America. The British designed laycock DeNormanville overdrive can sometimes not engage when using the heavier gear oils. Whenever I speak to people who have been using gear oil without problems, I say don't change what already works, but if there are problems with the overdrive working, the first thing I check is the weight of the oil. The Non detergent spec on the motor oil is to keep foaming down inside the overdrive.

Just curious, what don't you like about the MTL 75/90?

Tom
'63 330 America #5053

andrew
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Re: Oil Recommendations

Post by andrew » Fri Jan 01, 2010 8:54 pm

Hi Tom,

You probably don't recall, but my 330 America has been fitted with a 5-speed, rather than the 4-speed with overdrive (the one non-original thing about it), which I actually like quite a lot. As for the transmission oil, the change to the MTL 75/90 coincided with slight trouble with a synchro -- I don't know if it's related or not, but it's a possibility, so a simple change in oil is my first step, followed by other diagnoses if necessary. That's why I wondered what others are using and having success with.
'64 330 America s/n 5109

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tyang
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Re: Oil Recommendations

Post by tyang » Sat Jan 02, 2010 9:29 pm

andrew wrote:Hi Tom,

You probably don't recall, but my 330 America has been fitted with a 5-speed, rather than the 4-speed with overdrive (the one non-original thing about it), which I actually like quite a lot. As for the transmission oil, the change to the MTL 75/90 coincided with slight trouble with a synchro -- I don't know if it's related or not, but it's a possibility, so a simple change in oil is my first step, followed by other diagnoses if necessary. That's why I wondered what others are using and having success with.
Hi Andrew,

Sorry I forgot. This website was very much a result of my bad memory!

I'd be curious to hear if you notice a difference on the change in transmission oil. Keep us posted.

Tom
'63 330 America #5053

enio45
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Re: Oil Recommendations

Post by enio45 » Wed Jan 13, 2010 12:00 am

Thanks guys for your response - let me contact restoration supplies and get some it!
Ed Montini
330 GT 2+2 Series II - 8289
58 Ellena - 0855GT - orig drivetrain

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AllTwelve
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Re: Oil Recommendations

Post by AllTwelve » Thu Nov 15, 2012 4:32 pm

Hi Folks,

I'm looking into trying the redline synthetic in my '71 Daytona gearbox, as I have the 2nd gear syndrome too. Should I use the MT 90, or MTL 75/90? Does one version have a limited-slip additive, and should I use that with the Daytona?

I've read that "Redline is also offered in an NS version, which has no additive for the limited-slip differential. This additive which inhibits synchro operation - and thus shifting might be smoother without it - but you may get shuttering of the limited slip in slow corners" (Forza, issue 122, December '12). I certainly don't want any shuttering from the LS, but want a smooth shift from 1st to 2nd - and even more importantly - down from 3rd to 2nd. The article makes it sound like you can't have it both ways. Hope this isn't a catch22!

Thanks,

Gianni

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tyang
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Re: Oil Recommendations

Post by tyang » Sat Nov 17, 2012 10:53 pm

Hi Gianni,

I think you'll need to have the differential additive for the LS to work properly. Synthetic will only go so far to eliminating the symptoms of the weak or slow synchro. If the redline doesn't help, the only solution will be new synchros.

Good luck.

Tom
'63 330 America #5053

8339
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Re: Oil Recommendations

Post by 8339 » Sun Nov 18, 2012 10:35 am

Most if not all of the older Ferrari gearboxes use Porsche type synchros. The synchros rely on friction in order to function properly, most, not all, synthetic gear box fluids have additives that may be too "slippery" for synchro operation. I see this once every coupe of months, especially with Alfa owners who insist on using the newest fluids in their car and then wonder why the gearbox "grinds" when shifting. I always replace the trans fluid with dino 90 weight gearbox oil, the oil that came in the trans in the first place. GL-5 gearbox fluid designed for extreme pressure can even cause more probelms in a trans especially if there's yellow metals involved. GL-5 fluids have Sulphur compounds designed to etch the metal surfaces to carry more oil. That's fine in a hypoid differential but not necessarily in a transmission. If you can find the fluids that were used originally, in my hunble opinion, you're much better off.

Richard Garre
Radcliffe Motorcar Company

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AllTwelve
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Re: Oil Recommendations

Post by AllTwelve » Sun Nov 18, 2012 10:36 am

Thanks, Tom.

I was looking at the many LS additives available online. Is there a particular brand that works best?

Also, which Redline - MT 90 or MTL 75/90?

Grazie!

Gianni

airsanford
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Re: Oil Recommendations

Post by airsanford » Sun Nov 18, 2012 8:50 pm

Castrol used to make a GL-4 90 wt that was the factory fill and spec for early BMW 2002s that had Porsche type syncromesh. GL-5 would make them grind bigtime. As mentioned, the GL-4 has none of the Hypoid additives that cause the oil to cling to the internal surfaces and gears in operation.
I"m not advocating anyone try this in a vintage Ferrari, but by the time I left BMW they were running ATF in manual shift cars. It is also factory fill in many current manual transmissions. We were running Redline ATF in 5 speeds with excellent results.

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