New brake calipers?

[hgraham]

I've had my 330GT in a shop for the last 9 months (ugh!) and now that it's started pouring rain, everything came together for it to be finished. I was supposed to be picking it up on Friday, but got a call last night from the mechanic. He was going to move the 330 into an accessible position for the big day when he discovered that the rear calipers were frozen in the "brakes on" position and the car wouldn't budge. Part of the initial reason for bringing the car in was that the rear calipers were frozen in the other direction. He took them apart and rebuilt (but didn't resleeve) them, and now they're doing this. He said that they had already been resleeved at some point, so the best option was to purchase new calipers. Does anyone have advice on this, or at the least a good source for new calipers?

[afwrench]

Seems strange that calipers would refreeze .Is there a flex line like in the front that might be collapsed internally? Mike

[tyang]

I'm assuming the shop cracked the bleeder, and the brakes stayed on? If they released after opening the bleeder, it could be a bad soft hose. Depending on the seal kit used, and what diameter the bore of the previous rebuild, you could be having issues with the new seal kit jamming in bores. I know Karps Brake service was having problem with seal kits being too large for a stock bore.

Unfortunately, finding stock pistons is getting harder and harder. The rear pistons varied in bore diameter, and the bolt spacing may be different from other Dunlop pistons on Jaguars. I know there's a company that makes billet Stainless Steel replacements for Jaguar, but I don't know if they have the same bolt spacing for the rear calipers on a Ferrari.

I was hanging out with a fellow 330 America owner and he gave me one spare rear piston with a brass sleeve already inserted, but that's only one. If it were me, I would take the rear pistons apart and try to figure out what's jamming. If they need to be machined again, it may be easier than trying to find four pistons that will probably have to rebuilt and resleeved anyway.

Good luck.

Tom

[hgraham]

Thanks as always for the quick reply, Tom. I forwarded that on to the mechanic. He's a neighbor who happens to run a Ferrari shop at the local raceway (Infineon), but hasn't worked on the older cars in a while. Having advice like yours saves days worth of leg work on our parts and, in this case, might save quite a bit of money and frustration! I'll keep you posted with the findings and fixes.

[tyang]

I see this problem a lot around here with shops working on VIntage Ferraris. Shops that are competent working on newer Ferraris are not familiar with the needs and processes with working on the older cars. They are used to ordering parts that are consistent, available, and reliable! Working on older Ferraris, we are faced with changing suppliers, diminishing numbers of competent rebuilders, and parts availability. When I have a job come in, I usually have to plan ahead in getting parts that I know are sometimes hard to get. As I wrote about in a recent post, many times, we have to make parts from scratch, and closely inspect the pieces we're trying to fix to determine why there was a failure.

Good luck!

Tom

[8339]

Roelofs Ferrari Parts in Holland does produce a piston assembly that will "bolt" up to your existing caliper. These are new components and are supposed to work exceptionally well. Of the few products I've purchased from them they are top drawer. I do think the stainless piston assemblies for older Jags would work as well. Keep something else in mind I've run into before, it may the master cylinder and not the rear caliper pistons. As Tom mentioned the newer seals are thicker and can cause binding issues, I've had that with master cylinders and it did in fact lock up the back brakes, due to the fact the two peice piston in the master would only move one piston.


Richard Garre
Radcliffe Motorcar Co.

[hgraham]

Thanks again for the copious advice. I'll pass it all along to my mechanic. I did talk with him about your last post, Tom, and he said that he did crack the bleeder but little fluid came out and it didn't unlock the calipers. He also had an issue with the rebuild kit not fitting the sleeved cylinder, but took measurements and ordered appropriate seals. He mentioned that he suspects a bad center pin. To my knowledge, the rear calipers haven't worked since I've owned the car, but were thankfully frozen open rather than closed. Is the master cylinder something to check now? Are the rear brakes on these cars on the same circuit instead of having one front and opposite rear?

Hudson

[hgraham]

I should mention that this mechanic is very familiar with the older cars, as he worked in a vintage Ferrari shop in NY for quite a while in his younger days. He went on to race Ferraris, then opened a shop here catering more to that interest. The thing that's changed since his "old days" is the parts availability and, now that he's in California, he's isolated from the great NY/CT vintage community and shops that he was used to working with.

[tyang]

I should mention that this mechanic is very familiar with the older cars, as he worked in a vintage Ferrari shop in NY for quite a while in his younger days. He went on to race Ferraris, then opened a shop here catering more to that interest. The thing that's changed since his "old days" is the parts availability and, now that he's in California, he's isolated from the great NY/CT vintage community and shops that he was used to working with.

I certainly did not want everyone to think I was speaking about your mechanic in particular, so no offense!

It's not only having the right community, but the right information. A few years ago, we had a head gasket issue that was working its way through all the shops that did engine rebuilds. Some of these gasket sets are still in circulation, and if you didn't know, you could still be having the problems that was happening from 6 years ago. We're currently having these issues with the brake seals.

I think there just as many shops in CA that work on these cars compared to NY, and some of these shops may even tell you where to go to find the specialists!

Good luck!

Tom

[250GT]

Jaguar and Lancia Flaminia also use on Rear 1 5/8" and are compatible including the 4 holes.
they dont use "our " Front 2 1/4" ones
the rear ones are often made by Girling and are missing the Dunlop logo.
the Rear 1 5/8" is easy to find and, not that expensive.
Maybe 100€ each.
only for you info.

C.

[hgraham]

Tom: no offense taken. I thought that the mechanic's background would help put the responses in context, and didn't want anyone thinking I had just taken the 330 down to the local dealership to have them troubleshoot it

250GT: thank you for that. I'm glad to know that there are inexpensive parts potentially available to fix the problem. The nice part about this shop's location at the racetrack is that there are hundreds of specialty shops within the same complex. Today the mechanic was going to walk over to the British restoration shop and borrow a Jag caliper to check the fit. Must be nice!

[tim]

Greetings... I recently bought seal kits from British Parts Northwest for less than I paid 25 years ago. I've seen them listed from Ferrari sources for twice the price or more. www.bpnorthwest.com Tim

[hgraham]

It's amazing how much a part can get marked up when you write Ferrari on the box! That site looks like a great resource and has good prices. I just wish they had Land Rover stuff for my other project.