Wow... I finally have a 330 2+2!

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Matt F
Posts: 232
Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2003 4:22 pm
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

Wow... I finally have a 330 2+2!

Post by Matt F »

My dream car finally arrived yesterday: a 1967 Series II 330 GT 2+2, s/n 9453.

It's a gorgeous silver with black interior.

Luckily, the weather here in Pittsburgh has been great (at least for a February). I've put a few miles on the clock in the past two days.

I posted here earlier, questioning how the power steering on these cars felt. I can now answer definitively: the power steering is awesome. It's a revelation; all new cars should be this good. It's completely unnoticable and acts almost telepathically.

The brakes feel like they need to be bled. There's a lot of play before they engage. I'm a little imitated to take on the job, partially because I'm not used to Ferrari knock-off wheels, but mostly because I'm working from a Series I manual that had a completely different brake system!

The engine is fantastic, and revs so quickly that I'm going to have to speed up to catch up with the car's reflexes.

Please wish me luck with the new steed in my stable. Also please give me any brake advice you have. Thanks in advance,

Matt

P.S. If I succeed in attaching a pic, it's an old one fron the 330 Registry.

Image
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tyang
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Post by tyang »

Hi Matt,

Congratualtions!!!

I'm sure you'll have many joyous moments in that car.

One tip I've heard on the getting the knock-off off is to use two hammers. Keep the lead one in contact with the spinner, and hit that one with another hammer. This can help keep better aim. A dead blow hammer can also help from damaging the wheels, but will not last long.

Hendrix wire wheel (in my supplier's page) sells a nice lead hammer so you can keep the Ferrari hammer safe for the shows.

Tom

P.S. I'm sure the future Ferrari owners that visit this site would love to hear how you got your car.
'63 330 America #5053
Deane
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Joined: Tue Sep 03, 2002 11:43 pm
Location: Cupertino. CA

Post by Deane »

Hi Matt,

If you're chicken to swing a big hammer at your soft alloy wheels (my experience: it turns out it's best to hold off on the beer until AFTER you're done), you can also accomplish the same task with less drama using a knock-off socket from Mike Kumor at www.seaportmold.com, and the cheap 3/4" torque wrench from Harbor Freight.

Have fun!

Deane
Deane
'67 330GTS (gone but not forgotten)
fest
Posts: 415
Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2003 10:59 pm

brake bleed

Post by fest »

Matt-

congratulations!
(and keep that wallet handy, you'll be needing it!)

I have bled the Brakes on my 400i not so long ago
and so can offer encouragement, at least

the 400i may be even more intimidating
when it comes to Brake Service
as it has 2 seperate circuts PER CALIPER
(a la the Daytona)
and 3 Bleeder fittings on each caliper

I did approach this service with some trepidation
and did in fact screw it up the first time around
(let one of the resevoirs run dry)
but it all turned out OK in the end

in fact, I was afraid that my car needed more attention
than merely bleeding the brakes
but I was pleasantly surprised at how much they improved
after the Bleeding process was completed successfully
(and was thourougly disgusted with the condition of the Brake Fluid
that came out of my Bake System, I might add)

I cannot overstress the importantance of bleeding the Brakes
(meaning completely changing the Brake Fluid,
NOT just purging out any air)
on ANY older car, especially Ferraris
this is often overlooked and or neglected
and the Brake Fluid can get down right NASTY
I would recommend this be an annual service
(and I believe the Service Manual will concur)

as for the procedure
I used the basic technique
that I would use on any car-
get a helper and bleed them manually
i.e. 'Hose and Jar' method
NOTE: I have tried pressure bleeding
Mity-Vac, etc, etc
and have found the tried and true method
is still the best


The Service Manual is interesting
in that it states to start with the nearest i.e. shortest circuit-
e.g. the LH Front Caliper
wheras I always start from the furthest i.e. longest circuit
e.g. the RH Rear Caliper
this may not matter

I always get a kick out of the procedure
as outlined in the Service Manual for my car-
they show the Brakes being bled into a Wine Bottle!
(I use a Pickle Jar, as it is more stable)

as for fluid, I hear that Castrol LMA
is the fluid of choice
(I bought a gallon of NAPA Brand DOT 4, however)

be real careful around paint and interior
Brake Fluid (especailly used) is NASTY

other than that,
I usually put a light coating of
Anti-Sieze on the Brake Bleeder Fittings
to help avoid future snap offage-
(as the fittings are drilled and cross drilled)
they tend to break easily
combined with the Steel Fittings in
Aluminum Castings syndrome
they can be in there real tight
I 'crack' them with a 6-Point Socket
THEN bleed with an open-end

other pointers:
naturally this is a good time to asses
the General Health of the Brake System-
Hoses, Seals, Pads, Calipers, Rotors, etc
as well as assess Suspension Condition
Shocks, Ball Joints, Control Arm Bushings, etc

Wheel Bearings?
Exhaust Hangers?
etc, etc, etc
(You get the idea)
Michael Bayer
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Joined: Mon Nov 04, 2002 7:22 am

Post by Michael Bayer »

Matt: Add my congratulations - and the conviction you will love this car more with every passing year! Do insure the power brake vacuum line is clamped tight on both ends (but not too so as to crack the plastic fitting on the brake boster). And give the engine and transmission lots of time to warm up, yesterday in 60 degree Washington DC, mine needed 30 minutes of running before she reached anything near ambient temperature and at that, the transmission was still cold and slow, you will get the hang of second gear starts and double cluthes from 1st to 2nd until the transmission and synchros warms then all is so well! Michael Bayer #9727
enio45
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Location: Gilbert, AZ

Post by enio45 »

Matt - congrats on the car - it looks great.....

:D
Ed Montini
330 GT 2+2 Series II - 8289
58 Ellena - 0855GT - orig drivetrain
87 El Camino SS
Rudy van Daalen Wetters
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Post by Rudy van Daalen Wetters »

Congratulations on the car. Good looking machine.

Rudy
Michael Bayer
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Post by Michael Bayer »

Matt: One more thing to add to the terrific advice previously posted: NO SILICONE BRAKE FLUID!!! M
Matt F
Posts: 232
Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2003 4:22 pm
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

Post by Matt F »

Thanks, guys, for all the kind words of encouragement and advice.

Tom: thanks for the idea of using two hammers; that's great advice. I'll also post the story on how I found my car in a seperate post soon.

Fest: I was pretty surprised by the factory manual, too. I always thought that you should bleed the caliper furthest from the master cylinder first. Do I have to do an extra bleeding at the vacuum booster? The Series I manual I have (that works for two seperate vacuum systems) seems to recommend that those need to be bled too.

Michael Bayer: all connections are good, and the hoses are in fine shape. Why do you discourage DOT 5? What are your experiences with it? How did you flush the old fluid out?

Here's my current to-do list:
--Bleed the brakes
--Put vintage-looking seat belts in the back so that I can install a car seat in for my 8 month old son.
--Machine some seat spacers so that I sit a bit higher.
--Install a stereo for long trips. (Which I hope to take a lot of!)

Thanks again,

Matt
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tyang
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Post by tyang »

Hi Matt,

DOT 5 is Silicone brake fluid, and is very different from DOT 3 or 4. DOT 5 is safer for paint, and supposedly won't absorb water, but can be harder to bleed the air out of a system, and is slightly compressible (perhaps because small bubbles stay in suspension).

Installing DOT 5 in a system that had 3 or 4 is also pretty involved. Since the silicone based fluid is NOT compatible with the alcohol based DOT 3 and 4, all of the old fluid must be removed. This means everything has to be stripped and cleaned with brake cleaner, reassembled, a filled with the new fluid. A simple bleeding with new fluid will not only be inadequate, but dangerous. The mixing of the two fluids will make a gel that can make the brakes inoperable.

Your booster should be bled before you bleed any of the calipers. Bleed it like a caliper, but be careful where the brake fluid squirts out!

I recommend Castrol LMA brake fluid. It's most compatible with the Lucas seals found in the Ferrari brakes.

Tom
'63 330 America #5053
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Tom Wilson
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Post by Tom Wilson »

I think this thread is the third time that Mike Kumor's Knock-off wheel socket ( www.seaportmold.com ) has been mentioned on this site, so I finally checked it out. After emailing Mike a time or two, I bought one for $125.00. I got it last week and it works great. The socket fits the Borrani Knock-Offs well and is rubber coated to prevent scratching. I feel much more comfortable using this tool then hitting my great looking wheels with a hammer!

I also followed Deane's advice and got the 3/4" Torque Wrench ($59.99) from Harbor Freight ( www.harborfreight.com ). It seems to be a good quality tool and worked well on the wheels. Not only that, but at almost 3' long, this sucker looks really cool hanging above my work bench!
matt
Posts: 112
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2004 10:22 pm

Post by matt »

Tom: Thanks for the tip on the knock off tool.I purchased a used one(It sounds like the same as yours),but have not yet tried it out.I have a 3/4 wrench with no torque reading and would need to put a piece of pipe on it to get enough strength to take the spinner off. How do you know what the proper torque should be.I would hate to loose a wheel! I am considering your recomendation for the torque wrench.
Deane
Posts: 141
Joined: Tue Sep 03, 2002 11:43 pm
Location: Cupertino. CA

Post by Deane »

Patrick Ottis out here on the west coast uses about 275ft-lb on the knock-offs, so that $60 300ft-lb torque wrench is a good match for the job - as long as you weight more than 100lb, or else the wrench won't be long enough.
Deane
'67 330GTS (gone but not forgotten)
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